Tini Teaches the Importance of Using Proper Course Structure for Maximum Performance

Jeremy Deighan
What's up everyone, thanks for checking out the show today. We have Tini with us, who is going to talk about her journey into online course creation, and really give us a lot of strategies on how we can structure our course and make sure that it really flows really well so that it just provides the best student experience possible. I'm so glad to have you on the show today. How are you doing?

Tincuta Nitu
Hey, I'm so glad to be here. Hey, everyone.

Jeremy Deighan
It's great because I've been following you a little bit because we kind of criss-cross in the same realm of online course creation. And I love what you're doing out there. And I think this is gonna be a great episode.

And I always like to get the history of where someone came from and kind of their background. So if you could, can you just give us a moment and talk about what you were doing before you got into online courses? And then how did you get into this world?

Tincuta Nitu
Oh, man, I was doing all sorts of crazy things. And you know, when you're finishing college, you have no idea that you're going to end up doing something completely different. But it all came back around. And I'm happy to say that I'm doing something that I was doing as a little girl. I was teaching an imaginary classroom. And I was drawing with chalk on my wooden desk. And at some point, I was cleaning that desk with water. And you know what happens when you mix water and wood, right? So it was really crazy. And I'm really happy that I'm doing that right now.

Because, look, when I started my online business, it was on nutrition on how to design meal plans for people. I was doing that at a personalized level. When I was creating those meal plans, I found myself drained of energy because I did not have time to enjoy my life because I had to work with people on their meal plans. And that was taking up a lot of my time. So, and I couldn't work with a lot of people. I could only work with about five or so.

And I found myself in the position of having to pause orders from coming in so that I could focus on the clients that I already had. So I got the idea, what can I do to serve more people at the same time and also free up more of my time? Because I wanted to enjoy my life as well. And that idea was to create a course.

And that's how my first course was born. But it did not happen overnight. And I postponed it for six months because I felt I did not have what it takes to create a course. And it has to be an awesome course to stand out because there are other courses out there. And I had no idea how to turn a personalized service into an online course.

So I gathered the courage. And at some point, I saw a guy creating a course in 10 days, and I said, "Oh my god if he can do it, I can do it too." So I created that course on meal planning. Yeah, then all sorts of things happened.

I found myself taking a break from social media for two months to regroup. And in that timeframe, I worked with experts directly on their courses, and I helped them structure all those wonderful ideas they had. And that's how I discovered my superpower for creating online courses. And now I'm teaching that to other people, as well as working with them one-to-one at the same time.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, awesome. We'll definitely kind of pick apart all those different aspects of your story. So going back to the beginning, when you were working with people on a personalized level, were you doing this in person, or was this online where you were finding people and just providing meal plans for them?

Tincuta Nitu
It was online because I knew even back then that I would enjoy this work-from-home lifestyle, and I wanted to create that for myself.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, very good. So, you get in there, and you're working with these people, you're creating meal plans, changing their lives, but it just became too much for you, and you decided, "Okay, I need to find a way where I can create a course and help more people and not have to be so one-on-one." Is that correct?

Tincuta Nitu
Yes. And it also comes down to how people like to consume content. And, you know, when you get an idea to do something, it's more exciting than someone else telling you what to do. So by going through a self-study course and creating your own meal plan, you kind of feel that excitement. Yeah, I did that.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, cool. Cool. So you went, and you said you found out how to create the course, you started working on it, and then eventually launched it. And we'll go back to you taking a break on social media because I want to ask you about that. Because I feel like that's kind of important, too.

But when you created the course, in the beginning, what did that look like? How were you creating the course? What tools or software were you using? Where did you upload this course in the very beginning?

Tincuta Nitu
I did not feel comfortable showing my face on video. I did not even have a webcam at that point, except for the one on my laptop, which wasn't good. I started looking into voiceover slides. I was good at creating presentations that were simplified and only capturing the essential bits of what I was talking about and not overwhelming people.

So I started there and actually did. I recorded the audio on Audacity and edited it. Oh, my god, that's a funny word. And I synced everything up and with the slides. And I posted my first course on Udemy.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, cool. So you did some voice-over slides, some presentations, and then put that course up on that platform. Now, at this point in your journey, I know you were working with people on their meal plans. Did you have an audience at this point? Or were you just throwing this up on Udemy and just hoping for the best?

Tincuta Nitu
Well, I forgot to mention something. I was working with Romanian customers because I'm originally from Romania, and my business started in Romania. At the point when I decided to create the course, I had already moved to Germany. And I made this decision to switch everything to English. Because I felt more comfortable speaking the language, well, it's not like I wasn't comfortable speaking Romanian. It's just different. Because I was using it here in Germany, as well, so that's how I started.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, so you put the courses on Udemy. And then what were those early days like? Did you start making sales on the platform right away? Because you know, if anyone's listening and is not familiar with Udemy, it's a marketplace where students are already coming to the platform. And so they help you promote and market your course. Did you see success right away with that platform?

Tincuta Nitu
Yes, I did. But it depends on the type of course that we're creating there. I have three courses so far on Udemy, and that one on meal planning is the most successful one. I think I have about, maybe at this point in time, about 1,700 students on that single course. So I did not have an audience when I started because I was just completely switching my language and everything and my audience.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, gotcha, gotcha. Okay. Very good. So you put the course up on the platform. And then I imagine, over time, you started getting some sales. And did you continue making more courses on that platform?

Tincuta Nitu
Yes. I created the next one was on how to build healthy habits and how to get rid of unhealthy habits. It's a four-part strategy. And at that point, yes, I did have an audience, I started building a Facebook group. And that's really funny because now I have a different Facebook group because I changed directions from nutrition and wellness to course creation.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, awesome. Yeah. And I want to ask you about that and kind of dive into the subject today, which is, you know, structuring your course. But before we get into that, I would like to go back because you mentioned in the beginning that you needed to take a break from social media.

And so, being an entrepreneur, a solopreneur, an online business can be a very tough job. And sometimes it can be very lonely too because we're just sitting here by ourselves working away. We're not going to a job sometimes and seeing other people and so forth. So can you tell me a little bit more about taking that break from social media? Why did you do that? And what was the benefit of doing that?

Tincuta Nitu
I took the break last year, that's 2020 in August, and it was an intentional break. I really wanted to regroup because I felt drained of energy. I was running a Facebook group on wellness. And I didn't feel like I was aligning with what I could do. And I felt that something was missing, and I really wanted to take a step back and just not be bombarded with other people's opinions and just figuring things out by myself. I took that break.

During that break, I think it was two months. And I wrote a book. I edited another one because I also write, and I wanted to get in touch with my creative side as well. And I worked with experts, one-to-one on Fiverr on their courses. And that was a game-changer for me because I found that I was enjoying that so much. And people were just messaging me and saying, "Hey, I had no idea a service like yours existed." And then, oh my god, yes, I found my superpower.

So that was the break. And then I came back. I did not just come back immediately. Yes, people were saying, "Yeah, you're awesome" or whatever, and "your service is cool." I enjoyed the break. And I took a step back.

And when I came back, I came back with this idea that life is meant to be lived right now. And we're not just mainly meant to work, work, work, hustle, and then at some point, stop and enjoy our lives. And it all comes down to being ourselves, and also embracing simplicity. I'm all for simplicity and minimalism and stuff like that because I find that there's great power in keeping things simple and leaving out the fluff.

Jeremy Deighan
Yeah, that is absolutely amazing. I love that story. Because, like I said, you know, we push so hard all the time. And we try so hard to make this work, and we're always just in it, constantly, go, go, go. And there's that whole hustle mentality that you can't stop. And you know, that can really end up hurting a lot of people. And I think it's important to hear you say that, that it's important to take breaks, it's important to step away, get in touch with your creative side, get back in touch with, you know, just who you are and the things that you want to accomplish.

And look how it turned out, you were able to take a break, refresh your mind, regroup, regain your energy. And on the other side of that were some great things where you found out your superpower and your ability to help others. And I just think that that is so important.

And I also like what you said about simplifying and being, you know, a minimalist. This is a concept that we learned a couple of years ago. And we had a house, and we had all this stuff, all this stuff we had bought and all these different, you know, just junk basically in our house.

And our family decided to start traveling. And in doing so, we got rid of like 80% of the stuff we owned. And it was very hard for me because I'm a very material, you know, attached type person.

And when my wife would start throwing stuff in the trash, I was just freaking out. But it's so relieving. You know, once I got through that, and once I was able to get rid of all this stuff and realize I didn't need it. And it was really just hindering my life and really come back down to the core concept of being a human. It was just, it was amazing. So I love that you said that.

So, going forward. So, you find your superpower. You realize that you can really help experts create courses. So let's get into that. Let's talk about how are you able to help people who have an expertise? What is it that you specifically do for them?

Tincuta Nitu
Okay, so these are coaches, entrepreneurs who mainly work one-to-one with people, but I know that they can make a bigger impact through an online course. And by doing so, they also free up their time because there are so many cool things out there for us to do, even if, whatever, we're living in these times right now. But there are so many cool things. But when we don't have the time to choose those things, and to really enjoy them, then what's the point?

So by creating a course, they're able to reach more people and to free up their time. And I take their idea, their ideas, and expertise and package it nicely into a unique and fresh course. Because a course is not just information thrown together, it's information and implementation as well because we want to leave space for the people who go through our course to have the time and to really implement what is required of them. Otherwise, they won't see results.

And if they don't see results, then we think that "Oh my god, what I'm doing is not good, and I cannot help people." But sometimes, it's just the flow of the course that matters and makes the most impact.

Jeremy Deighan
One thing I noticed you said was that you were finding people through Fiverr. Is that correct?

Tincuta Nitu
Yeah.

Jeremy Deighan
So I really haven't heard of that kind of strategy before. I'm familiar with Fiverr. It's a place where there are, you know, freelancers and people who can do different jobs for you. So can you just briefly talk about that strategy? How were you using Fiverr to find these people?

Tincuta Nitu
I just posted my gig there. I did not focus on it that much. But apparently, people were interested in this service that I was offering on bringing their idea, their course, and book ideas to life. And I described my service and that I was going to create an outline for their course. Or if they wanted content suggestions because I was targeting this mainly towards health and wellness coaches because I don't like to do something that I'm not experienced in, so I had my experience in health and wellness. So I had my experience in health and wellness. And then extended outlines.

And people were just really happy with their products. They were excited to start recording based on the format that I was giving them. So it was kind of like a done-for-you service. And they came back to me and said, "Hey, would you mind creating the entire course for me and everything and expanding the script and everything?" That's what I was doing as a freelancer, let's call it that, on Fiverr.

And then when I came back from the break, I looked at what I was doing, "Hey, what is it that I'm really doing for these people?" And I broke it down. And then I created online courses on this particular process that I'm using to structure courses.

Jeremy Deighan
Perfect. Okay, cool. That sounds great. So let's talk about that process. So if someone comes to you and say they have an expertise in nutrition, and they are, you know, maybe a nutritional coach, and they're working one-on-one, and they want to do what you did, and create an online course, so they can impact more people.

What are the phases? What are the steps that you would walk someone through into creating that course and making sure that they have a good structure and a good flow to the course?

Tincuta Nitu
It depends on what they want to achieve with that course. And, for instance, there are people who, and how I work with them. So if I work with them one-to-one, there are done-for-you elements included. If they choose to have those, most of them just choose to start with a short course, a mini-course that solves a specific problem that their audience has.

So they already have an audience. They know that their audience is ready for a course. And they know their audience really well. They're the expert at what they do, so they don't need to ask the audience, "Hey, guys, are you interested in this course?" They just want to give someone a result.

So in nutrition, it could be, let's say, someone wants to lose weight. And their biggest problem right now is that they're dealing with cravings, maybe for sweet things or salty things. And yeah, they create a course on how to help people get rid of cravings. And it's not just "Hey, guys, here are ten tips to get rid of cravings." You just have to look at things from either from the beginning.

Because you know, there are different things, different ways to outline a course. You can either start from the beginning, and you figure out the steps that come after that starting point until you reach the result that you want. Or you can reverse engineer and start from the result and say, "Okay, what happens right before I get this result?" And work your way backward.

And there's also the brainstorming one, which is kind of my favorite. And you sit down, and you brainstorm all these ideas, and you just look at those ideas. Hey, what's essential from this list of ideas for my client and/or student to see results? And those become your modules or your lessons.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, how do you brainstorm particularly? I know I do it a certain way, but what is your method of brainstorming some course ideas?

Tincuta Nitu
Okay, I just sit down, and I write the main idea in the middle of a blank piece of paper because I love to write. And I just start writing things down. Just relating that to the result of my client that my client needs to have, and I use, with my clients, I use questions to draw those ideas out. So that makes things easier. When you go, and you look at your message and why you're doing this, and you get inspired by the reason for which you're doing things.

Jeremy Deighan
Yeah, I love the questionnaire method of coming up with ideas. Typically, you know, a lot of course creators are by themselves, and they don't know how to teach. They don't know how to come up with ideas. But if you can get someone to, say, interview you and ask you questions, I find that's a really good way to come up with ideas.

Tincuta Nitu
Yeah, and I've got a sneaky one, too. And this also helps with getting used to the course content and getting yourself excited and used to talking about it. So I always imagine myself that I'm talking in front of an audience. And this is either in front of my mirror. I always used to say that my fridge knows everything about course creation.

So I just talk about it freely and kind of like, "Okay. Hey, guys, what's up? I'm going to teach you this. And here's how it's going to go." Because when you're talking about things, ideas just get organized in a different way, as opposed to only when we're thinking about those ideas.

So when we're talking, we also let those ideas flow. And they start to make sense. And the next time that we go to that piece of paper, we find new and exciting ideas that, I don't know, kind of make sense and connect with the other ones.

Jeremy Deighan
Nice. I like that. Yeah, that's a great technique to use. Mine's always been the post-it notes, I'll sit there, and I'll get a stack of post-it notes and just scribble all my ideas down real fast, and then try to figure out a way to put them together.

So whether you're writing, using post-it notes, talking out loud, you come up with a bunch of ideas, and sometimes they're not in the best order, or they're not sequential. So what are some things that course creators can do to make sure that they're structuring their course properly so that it flows nicely and make sense to the student?

Tincuta Nitu
Okay. You could build this skill over time, but if you want to do it right now, you can just take someone through your framework through your course. Someone that is interested in the topic that you teach, and you reach out to them, "Hey, I want to run this by you. Would you be open to do this?" And you just go through it.

So I created a course on energy for entrepreneurs. And this is a five-part technique to increase your energy, both physical and mental. What I did with that, I took people through the technique over the phone. And once I tested that technique, and I saw that it made sense, I turned it into a course. So that's something that someone can do to test the order of the lessons and the method.

Jeremy Deighan
Awesome. Yeah, I know a lot of people right now are talking about running beta programs for their courses, which is similar to what you're talking about. Getting a person, a couple of people, or a group of people, and kind of teaching them like you said, and then taking the information and recording it as you're teaching them and then going back and recording the course. Is that something that you've done before?

Tincuta Nitu
Yeah, I ran a beta. But it was free. I did not sell it. For some reason, in the beginning, I wasn't comfortable pre-selling. I don't sell a course before it's done. It's just something that I don't know.

I would sell a live event instead. And then, on the back of that event, I can create a course. So I record the lessons in a way that it flows, and I break them down into smaller lessons. So that someone doesn't have to sit there and listen to me for one hour, but they have the lessons that they're interested in.

Jeremy Deighan
But you think that that's a great way to come up with your course ideas is by talking to those people one-on-one first, just to kind of flesh out the ideas before you create the course?

Tincuta Nitu
Talking to people one-to-one, yeah, it can help you get ideas. But if you already have those ideas, and you want to know whether the structure for the course makes sense, then yeah, take someone through it if you can do it yourself. Because when we're talking about our expertise, and what we do, and the processes that we've been through, it's very rare that we document the process when it happens.

So if you can, right from this moment on, everything that you're doing, and you think that it would make sense to turn that into a course, go ahead and document your process, right as it happens.

Because if we think about something that happened in the past, and you want to teach that, for instance, if I were to start teaching how I lost weight, I wouldn't be able to figure out the essential pieces. And I might include some other stuff that's fluff in there. And that's not required for someone to see results.

Jeremy Deighan
Awesome. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. So let's say that someone goes through this process, they get this information, and then they put their course together. Now a big problem with course structure and the way that a course flows together is that getting someone to go to the next lesson or to complete a course.

As most course creators know, completion rates are really dismal. Hardly anyone completes a course. Or maybe they complete 40% or 60% of the course, and then they never finish it. So do you have any tips on how to get someone to take the next step in your course to keep taking those lectures, keep following through, and completing that course?

Tincuta Nitu
Sure thing. One is building connections with those people if you can. Because if someone you know goes through the course, they already know, like, and trust you. And they trust that if they go through your course, they will see results. So that's one thing.

Then the second thing is, a course has specific ingredients. And one of them is inspiration. You want to inspire people to go through your course and inspire people by showing them that it's possible for them to see results. You can do that by telling them why it's important for them to do something because people don't like to be told what to do.

And when you inspire them, and you tell them, "Hey, guys, okay, here's why this thing that you're about to learn is important." And then you teach that thing that's important. They're ready to implement what they've learned.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, awesome. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. So it's really about just showing them that transformation that they're going to achieve by going through this course.

Tincuta Nitu
Yes, you can do that by showcasing examples and make it relatable examples so they can see themselves when they have that result and how that feels.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, very good. So let's switch gears for a moment. And let's talk about a little bit more on the marketing side of things. So do you have any ways or methods that you market your courses? Or using organic marketing, content marketing, social media advertising, or anything like that to get people into your course now?

Tincuta Nitu
I have my Facebook community. And I do post content a lot on social media. Well, not a lot, a lot. You know, I like simplicity. Yeah, I'm there. So people see me, I also get invited to do interviews like this one. So thank you.

And yeah, this is important, but just showing up and showing up as yourself and doing things that you like. For instance, I don't really like to go just for one thing. I want to experience it first and see what it's like if I am to commit to it long term. So my next talk is going to be email marketing. And I have a sense that I'm going to like it, but I have to try it first.

Jeremy Deighan
Awesome. Let's talk about the Facebook group. I always felt like having a community is an important aspect when you're a course creator. But why do you have a Facebook group? Do you think that having a community is essential to building an audience?

Tincuta Nitu
No, it's not. It's not essential. It's not essential. But it's really cool to hang out with people who, I don't know, who are just a delight to hang out with. They're really cool people in the community. I get to know them, they get to know me, and we have fun.

Jeremy Deighan
Awesome, definitely. So thinking about, say, the beginner who's listening to this podcast, someone who's starting out on their journey. And knowing what you know now and being able to help all these different experts in these fields. What is maybe your number one piece of advice you could give that person who's just starting out?

Tincuta Nitu
It would be to simplify things. So things that you like to do focus on those because there's always something that you find that you love, and whatever that you do. And when you find that, it's going to be easier for you to go through the entire process.

And start with what you have available right now. I mean, yeah, get a quality microphone and all this stuff. But don't overcomplicate things by thinking, "Oh, I should get on this platform or this one or whatever." Just focus on the results and your passion for teaching what you know.

Because there are real people on the other side who really are waiting for your course, and they're waiting for it to be released into the world so they can grab it and solve their problems or learn something new because I'm also into personal development. So, why not? Why not have that course out there?

Jeremy Deighan
Nice. Yeah, I like that. And then I have another question specifically for you. Coming from your background, and you know, nutrition and fitness and whatnot, how important is it to have good nutrition and to stay in shape when you're an entrepreneur?

I know people, like I said in the beginning, are doing this alone. And they're on the computer all day long, and they're neglecting those things. So could you just speak a moment on the importance of having a good healthy body and system so that you can do more in your online business?

Tincuta Nitu
Definitely, and thank you for bringing this up. Because we are our business, right? And if we don't take care of ourselves, we're going to feel miserable, and we won't be able to enjoy all the rewards that we get. And we won't be able to enjoy all the notifications, "Hey, someone bought your course, someone finished your course," because you want to feel like it.

Good nutrition is also recommended, and hydration whenever you're recording because you're talking a lot. And when we're talking, water leaves our body, right? So we want to replenish that all the time. And one thing that I found to work with me is I combine things that I like and that I do so that I'm also staying in shape with ease.

So one of my things is that I do my one-to-one coaching sessions on audio-only so I can also get my steps in. I find that whenever I'm in movement, I get more and better ideas. And that's happening for my clients as well because it's kind of like an entire experience.

Jeremy Deighan
I imagine that it's also boosting, you know, some of the chemicals and the hormones in your body too. Because you are releasing those chemicals as you are, you know, walking or getting those steps in, which I think would elevate your attitude, and then that just is going to come through to your client, correct?

Tincuta Nitu
Yes, yes, that's absolutely correct. And you create energy by moving. So even when you're thinking about getting ideas, you can get ideas just by moving in a different way. As far as nutrition goes, just get some fresh foods. I mean, the ones that you see the colors, and they make you feel like, "Yeah, I'm gonna, I'm really gonna use those foods" because the body uses food as fuel. Right?

Jeremy Deighan
Yeah. And, you know, we're going through this right now. So my wife made a drastic change a couple of weeks ago and really started focusing on a lot more vegetables in the house. And I joke around that she's making me eat grass all day.

But, you know, we've switched to eating a lot more vegetables and greens, and reds and yellows, and it has really made a difference. It's even kind of hard now to go back and eat a hamburger. I feel miserable the next day, when I've eaten, you know, a hamburger and greasy fries and stuff like that.

Tincuta Nitu
Yeah. And that's the thing because you don't know until you try it. If you're eating fast foods and stuff, you don't know that there's a better world on the other side.

Jeremy Deighan
Yes. I totally agree with that. And I would have not agreed with that in a previous time in my life. Awesome. Well, very cool. So just looking out into the future, let's say the next year or two years or five years. Where would you like to take your business? What do you see for yourself going forward?

Tincuta Nitu
Okay, I'd like to be surprised. I like adventure, I always say that I have the spirit of a horse. And that also ties in with the oatmeal that I eat. So I do like to allow some elements of surprise because I just like to experience life as it happens, what I'm able to control and to do, I'm gonna do that.

And this brings me joy, helping people create their courses, and also creating other courses that help people stay in shape and that help people create their own courses. And that brings me joy right now. So I don't have an answer for you. Maybe we can talk in one year or two and see what happens.

Jeremy Deighan
Awesome. Yeah. Well, I definitely look forward to talking to you some more, both off the podcast and maybe in the future, having you come back on and seeing where you're at.

Tincuta Nitu
Yeah, I just invited myself on the show.

Jeremy Deighan
There you go. That's a good way to do it. I got to remember that one. Cool. So if anyone wants to learn more about you, your business, or maybe if there are some experts listening today that could use your help, what would be the best way for someone to find you online?

Tincuta Nitu
Okay, I'm on Facebook. You can find me there. It's the easier place to find me at. So since my first name and last name, it's kind of hard to write when I pronounced it. I'll just let you share the link.

Jeremy Deighan
Yes, definitely, Tini. We'll put those in the show notes. So if anyone is interested in finding out more about her business, go check out the show notes. And we'll link that up after we end the interview here. And thank you so much for coming on today and just sharing your knowledge and your expertise. It's been an absolute pleasure having you on the show today.

Tincuta Nitu
Thank you. It was really fun. Thank you.