Master the Emotions of Money with Financial Expert Bob Wheeler from The Money Nerve

January 31, 2022
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In today’s episode, we have Bob Wheeler with us and he is going to talk about how to master your emotions around money.

You will also get to hear why most people make illogical decisions around money, how to automate the process of building savings, and tax tips that will help you out in your online business.

Website: themoneynerve.com
YouTube: TheMoneyNerve
Facebook: TheMoneyNerve
Twitter: @themoneynerve
Instagram: @themoneynerve

Notes

In this episode, you will hear...

… Bob’s story before developing The Money Nerve.

… how to master your emotions around money.

… what is a scarcity mindset and how it can affect your life. 

… the reason most people make illogical decisions around money.

… how to automate the process of building savings.

… Bob talk about tax tips that will help you out in your online business. 

… how living within your means can give you financial freedom in life.

… Bob’s strategies on how to use your money more effectively.

… how to break a generational mindset on the subject of money. 

… Bob’s advice to business owners who are beginning to get a larger income.

Resources

Transcript

Jeremy Deighan
Hey, everyone, thanks for listening to the podcast today. We have special guest, Bob Wheeler, from The Money Nerve, who is going to talk about Mastering your emotions around money, which I think is a really great topic for this podcast. And for all you listeners out there.

Because you know, we are in a business. A businesses here to make profits. And a lot of people, myself included, you start getting money, and you might not know how to manage that money very well. I feel like some other people can feel me on that one.

So I'm excited to have you on the show today. I'm excited to talk about all things revolving around money. How are you doing today, sir?

Bob Wheeler
I'm doing great. Excited to be here. And I love talking about money.

Jeremy Deighan
Very cool. So yeah, I can't wait to dive into the topic. But for anyone who is not familiar with you, could you just take a couple minutes and tell us a little bit about your backstory, where you came from what you were doing, how you got into this thing we all know love and hate called money. And yeah, where that brought you to today?

Bob Wheeler
Yeah, absolutely. So I grew up in Tennessee, and I went to school so that I could be a lawyer. And then I met a few lawyers and I went, "Ah, not so much." Accounting was something that was always easy for me. So I was taking a lot of accounting just to help my grade point average, like most people, and basically, I started doing accounting, I got my CPA license.

At the same time, I was doing stand up comedy, because you know, gottta help supplement the income. And doing stand up, I ended up becoming the CFO at the world famous Comedy Store. I started my own accounting practice with over 1000 clients, worked with entrepreneurs.

And one of the things that I discovered along the way is that people were making very illogical decisions. I would say something, they'd go out and do the exact opposite of what I thought was really sound practical advice.

And so I really started looking at people's emotions around money, as well as looking my own personal track record, which wasn't so great. I could tell you to put the money away, and you would do it but I wouldn't. Right? And so it wasn't following my own rules.

And so it really started exploring all of that, and developed The Money Nerve and started doing workshops, started a podcast Money You Should Ask to really just start these conversations around money, and the unconscious and underlying beliefs and blocks we have around it.

Jeremy Deighan
Awesome. Yes. And I think it's, you know, pretty obvious to think that there are emotions and psychological triggers around money. But when you think of money you don't think about that.

You think money is, you know, hard cash, you know, it has no feelings, it has no emotion. So, what what do you mean, specifically, when you talk about the emotions around money?

Bob Wheeler
So there's a lot of people walking around with a belief that they're not enough, they don't deserve it, or everybody else can have success, but them, you know? I have clients inherit a lot of money, or they have a big success financially in their business, a lot of times, they will just blow right through that money and get right back to their comfort level of not being overdrafted or 10,000 bucks, or whatever that might be.

But a lot of us tend to gravitate back to what's comfortable. And there's just so many people out there very successful people that have so much shame around their money, around their money choices, if people only knew. And and so we really start to explore that, because that holds so many people back.

I know many people that have changed jobs because it required, they got promoted. And it required that they have to actually speak at management meetings, or certain things that were required that they felt was outside of their skill set. And they're like, "Yep, that's not for me. I'm not moving towards success. I'm going to run from it."

Jeremy Deighan
Yeah, it's such an interesting topic to think about because we all know, you know, celebrities, famous people, even entrepreneurs and business people who gain a lot of wealth and a lot of success and then they just blow it immediately.

It's almost like they're averse to having money. So why is that? Why do we see so many people who get that wealth, they have what they need to live and survive, and then a couple years down the road, they're broke again?

Bob Wheeler
Yeah, you know, there's so many different reasons. But a lot of it stems from the moment I have success. Now people might start asking me for money. I might have to set boundaries. I don't know if people like me for me, or if they want access to what I have.

And then all these doubts start to creep in, or things that I might have already been feeling get really amplified when I'm starting to have success. People might look at me and say, "You don't deserve that. I know people that are smarter than you," right?

And so then we want to preempt ourselves and go, "Yeah, I know I'm not the smartest person. I know, there's people better than me. I'm really sorry, I'm having success," right? We start to, like, we all want to go towards success. And then when we get it, we start apologizing for it. A lot of people.

Jeremy Deighan
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. It's just crazy that the money can just dramatically change people so much, right? Like that, you can just have something that can come into your life, and then just throw you for a total loop like that.

So when people start getting the success, and you've seen them, I'm sure in your practice, you know, throw this away. How do you help people? How do you teach them or train them to start using money effectively, or to start looking at success as something that they can have.

Bob Wheeler
So yeah, one of the first things I do is I really, really encourage people to start saving, even if they have debt, all debt. I really want to start to nurture that habit of saving money and paying myself first. So I really get people to do that.

With a lot of my clients, I'm also doing tax and tax strategy work with them. So as I'm having to put money away, I over estimate how much they need to put away. So what happens is, at the end of the year, when I tell them what they owe in taxes, now they've got all this extra money they didn't count on, and we can put that money into a pension, we can use that money to buy the new car or a down payment on a house.

And so I try to get people in the habit of over saving. So when they find they have this excess cash, they sort of like it. And it didn't really hurt them that much, even though they were like, "I can't put away money. I can't save." And so really trying to shift that mindset.

I also explore with people, what's the fear of being successful? What's going to happen if you have success? Are your parents going to judge you? Will your friends leave you?

Like what are all the worst case scenarios that could happen as you have success?Because a lot of that stuff is just in our head. And there will be people that will judge us and there will be people that won't root for us. But let's move forward anyway. And just knowing that we deserve to have success.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, very cool. So going back to the strategies that you talked about, you said that you encourage people to start saving and start putting a little extra away. This was something that I've been working on a lot more myself.

It seems like when we get money, we raise our cost of living to meet how much money we're getting right? Like that seems to be a common problem for people is, you're making $5,000 a month, you're living on $5,000 a month, now you're making $10,000 a month, and you want to live on $10,000 a month.

So I've been trying to get a little better myself about saving for this time. So what are some strategies that you can talk about when it comes to saving money so that we can you know, use that as an emergency fund or reinvesting? What are your thoughts on that?

Bob Wheeler
So I think the best way to help ourselves is to automate, right? We have to trick ourselves. So we all think we can outsmart ourselves. And so for me what I started doing initially, when I was in a lot of debt and trying to get back on track, I created several different online savings accounts.

And I have 50 bucks go to that one 100 bucks go to that one every week 25, 50, 100 was coming out and go into all these different accounts. And I just sort of didn't think about it, because 50 bucks here, 20 bucks there. And pretty soon all those bank accounts had money in it.

I made sure that none of them were tied back to my checking account. So that if I got low on funds, it didn't work as a, you know, overdraft protection, like that money was just sitting off on its own, isolated. And so the more that you can do those different little apps like Acorns that takes and rounds up your money, or different banks that will take the extra money and throw it into something, all those little things start to add up and start to build momentum.

So that a certain point, you'll say, "Oh, I want to get that to a bigger number quicker. What else can I do?" So automation is a great way to start to do that.I think sitting down with a financial planner, or a tax person to strategize about how to save on taxes, get some professional advice, and sort of map out a plan.

One of the other things for me, which seems maybe silly because it's not really actually money, but is making a list of what are my goals and priorities in life. Because if I really want to have a house, and I need to save for a down payment, unless I focus on that, if I'm out taking trips to Mexico and flying off to Paris and partying every weekend. That's money that could be going towards my down payment.

So if I'm really clear about what my long term goals are, then as I'm spending money I can check in and say, "Is that in integrity with what I'm trying to get to?" So that we don't self-sabotage.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, so being very focused on what it is that you're trying to accomplish, and then setting those goals so that you can achieve that outcome.

Bob Wheeler
Absolutely. Get very intentional. I love budgeting people get triggered by budgeting. So cash flow information, whatever you want to call it, looking at a budget, looking at your spending, and what you're talking about, living within your means. It's such a great concept, but it's so hard for us, right?

We want to, you know, we have this belief. Humans are funny, we think if we work harder, then we make more money and our future, it'll be even better. And then when we get to our future, we spend more money, because in the future, it's going to be even better.

And we're banking on our future instead of in the present. How can I actually start saving money or doing things that help me so that my future will actually be realized that I'll have much more money than I need?

Jeremy Deighan
Nice, yeah, I love this. You've hit on a lot of different points I want to talk about. It's great. I think we can really nerd out on this a lot. Because I'm very much like you. I like to budget, I like to make sure that I'm saving and doing everything.

But it was a process that I had to learn. I didn't come from a background where I knew how to do these things. And it wasn't until my late 20s, early 30s, when I really started paying attention. And I just wish I would have picked up some of these skills earlier in life.

You know, budgeting for me, like you said, it was scary. It was something that was a hassle. Why do I need a budget? But what I found is when I started to budget, and when I really started to pay attention to where the money was going, I became so much better at handling my money because I knew exactly what was getting paid, what bills were getting paid, where I was saving.

And I learned the value of saving money to have fun. I never thought of that before. That was a new concept to put some money aside and say, "This is money for you to actually go and have fun." And when you do that, it's kind of liberating for you to have a little bit of extra money to go and do some of the things that you do want to do in life. Is that something you agree with?

Bob Wheeler
Yeah, absolutely. It's funny, I do think we have to teach ourselves how to have fun, sometimes. I too, was so focused on I gotta do this and do this and I've got to hit this goal. And I got to make this amount of money. And I was so busy doing that. And I was having a good time.

But I wasn't stopping and actually saying, "Let me go have a week of pleasure. Let me take a vacation." And I really had to shift and say, "Wait a minute, let me get present. The whole point of working hard, is so I can actually enjoy my life." And I can live comfortably. There's no need to come from this mindset.

I come from a mindset of scarcity, like "Oh my God, oh my God." And so I have to fight against that sometimes when I get sort of silly in my head.

Jeremy Deighan
Yeah, definitely. Yeah, it's important. And you know, what's really great about that is when you put money aside to have fun, when you go use that money for fun, you don't feel like you're taking it out of your bills or your bank account.

You know, you've set that aside for that purpose. And it's very liberating in that sense. I wanted to go back real quick, because there's something else you mentioned that I wanted to ask you about.

You said that one of the things that you've done is that you've set up separate online savings accounts, so that you can automate the process, which I think is brilliant, and this is something that I would like to get better at.

So when you have these different savings accounts, are you setting up like just multiple different types of banks online? Or do you have one bank that you use that lets you set up multiple accounts? What does that look like?

Bob Wheeler
Yeah, so I have multiple ING, Ally Bank, Vault, Immigrant, I've got all these different banks and investment accounts, that will take 25-50 bucks. Now fortunately, I'm putting way more than that. But that's how I got started was 25 here, 25 there, 50 there.

And they're all completely different banks unrelated. The great thing about for me, the great thing about online banks is it takes three or four days for them to give you your money back. And so you have you can't just in a moment go, "Let me just take all the money. "You have to, you've got to wait for it. So it helped me curb my appetite for just spending impulsively.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, cool. Yeah, I really like that. That's, that's really good. Because I've been wondering about the best way to go about that for myself. And I think that would help some other people out there to have that ability to save money.

Now, when you have these accounts, are you saving towards a goal? Or are you just putting money aside for a rainy day? How do you tell yourself what these different accounts are going to be used for?

Bob Wheeler
So initially, it was just to get me in the habit of spending and considering it just one of my expenses. So I didn't have a plan other than I wanted to try and get each one of them to 1000 bucks to 5000 bucks without any, "This is going to pay for a trip." I just really wanted to just get in that habit of, "Oh, I've got excess money. It's there for whatever might come up." And so that was the initial goal just to build a reserve.

Just recently, I found out my, I haven't take my car in for a while. And at the end of the day, it's gonna cost me 5000 bucks. Now, I never spent any money on my car. So I'm like, 5000, oh, I have 5000 bucks, I've got a whole bunch of money in surplus that I've been saving.

Like, I think a good goal to reach is six months of life expenses. So if it costs you $5,000, a month to live, you need to put 3,000 bucks should be a goal to have and then work towards a year. Then besides that, if you want to take a trip, you want to get a down payment on a house, then yes, set up a separate account that's just for that. So you can see the house down payment account growing.

But initially, for me, it was just to get into the cycle of learning to save. And I think a lot of us always will save. You know, "As soon as I get that promotion, as soon as I get that bonus check, as soon as I win the lottery, then I'm going to start the saving."

No, just start it now. Five bucks, 10 bucks, 20 bucks, create the habit. And that's really was my goal initially.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, cool. So it's more about just getting the habit going. So that this is something that comes natural. Setting up the systems to automate the process, and just make it easier on yourself. Because, you know, you might forget about it for a little bit, and then look at your account one day and be pleasantly surprised.

Bob Wheeler
Exactly, absolutely. One of the other things that I've recently, probably been the last two years I've started having clients do, and I do this, too. I go into my bank accounts online, or open my wallet, and I actually just have fun conversations with my money.

I'm like, "Hey, guys, go out and bring in some of your friends like, bringing the big boys." And and to make it playful instead of stressful, because I used to go on to the bank accounts, like, "Oh, my God, like, what's my account balance," and now I'm comfortable, you know, so I could look at the accounts, and I don't panic.

But when I was first shifting that, there was always dread. So I try to make it fun. Because the world makes money heavy, sometimes, and we put so much financial pressure on ourselves that we stress out.

Jeremy Deighan
Yeah, and you know, having those savings, I think is very important to that not having that stress. Because I realized that when I started saving, when I started having extra, you know, revenue in the bank to call on for a rainy day, my stress levels went way down.

And then budgeting becomes fun, because when you have surplus of money, you're now having fun getting to tell your money what you want to do with it.

Bob Wheeler
Absolutely. And, you know, for people that are out there saying, you know, "That's not going to work for me," I did the exact same thing. I kept saying, "Well, you know, everybody else, and I know what I tell other people, but I'm not quite ready. I need these couple things."

No, you just have to do it. And once I actually just did it, things actually change. It didn't happen overnight. Did I go from out of debt to having surplus in my bank accounts, like in two months? No. But I started moving forward towards what I said I wanted and so people out there that are doubting yourself, if you actually just do it, if you actually just start taking baby steps, it's so much more rewarding.

Here's one thing that people can do that relates to budgetingg that's so easy. And I find it makes a huge difference is if you just carry a little notebook. And for all the money you spend and receive during the day you just write it down.

When I do workshops over a long period of time, people tell me, "I stopped spending money just so I don't have to write it down in the book so you won't see it." We change our habits when we hold ourselves accountable.

Jeremy Deighan
I want to talk about the mindset, too. So earlier you mentioned having a scarcity mindset. I think a lot of people will have this in the beginning especially If you maybe have started your own business, and you've come into wealth you haven't seen before, you might be holding on to kind of a scarcity mindset.

Can you talk a little bit on what that means? What is the scarcity mindset? And how can that affect people?

Bob Wheeler
So, scarcity mindset is there's never enough. I've got to be careful. There's never enough. I've got to hold on to everything I've got. And so what that does is it cheats me out of having a good time, because I got to hold that money. What if, what if?

When my parents got divorced, and we were not wealthy, I would run out and buy six months worth of food every time I got extra money just to fill on my pantries, because it would make me feel comfortable that if I didn't have any money coming in, I knew I could eat.

So what that did though, was I wouldn't take vacations because what if? And when spend on this because what if? And so I just became like a hoarder. Also, there's this sunk cost bias, right? I spent money on it, so I don't want to let it go. Because then I wasted the money.

And so I had this craziness, you know. I would obsess making sure I got every drop of soup out of my soup cans. People are like, "What are you doing?" I'm like, "Well, it said eight ounces, I got to make sure I got home eight ounces." So I became obsessive, instead of just being able to relax.

And so I think what happens with a lot of people is we do. We get in the scarcity mindset that what if what if, what if. And those things may never happen, it's it's a lot of it's imagined in our heads, certainly things can happen. But most of it is imagined.

And we've created these worst case scenarios. So people that came from the Depression era, people that come from other countries where there's just such a lack, it bleeds into the way they relate with their children, with their spouses, and we hold it and restrict it.

And money is is is isn't neutral energy that moves in and out. And we've got to be able to let the money go out for it to come back in, right? If I just charge all my clients and never use their services, and I'm just like, "Use me, use me, and pay me," but I never want to pay it back, you know, share my money going in the other direction, then I'm hoarding and that's, that's the scarcity mindset.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay. Now, how does having a scarcity mindset affect you? Like, why is that necessarily a bad thing?

Bob Wheeler
Well, it can be good in certain ways, because it helps you save, and it helps you be practical. And it can also rob you though, of relationships. It can rob you of having life experiences.

I had never traveled because that was for rich people. And a friend of mine said, "Hey, let's go to Greece, let's go run this marathon." I said, "I can't do that. I'm not a rich person." They were like, "What?"

And so in my mindset, I couldn't do that. Ultimately, I did it and broke this imaginary rule that I had. And I probably spent 2500 bucks on the trip. That's probably one of my, you know, best trips I ever had, it was life changing.

But my scarcity mindset was holding me back from possibility. And so what it does is I think it robs us of opportunity, and things that actually could serve us because we're afraid what if it doesn't go the way I planned? Or what if I wasted my money?

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, I think that's a good point. And you mentioned earlier about someone who grew up in the depression might have a different idea about money, then we may have, in our current time.

I was reading a book recently, great book called The Psychology of Money by Morgan Housel. And in that book, he was talking about how your time that you're growing up in, changes your outlook, and you might have a lot of your parents ideas about money.

Because if your parents grew up in the Depression, and they're hoarding, and they're saving, and all this, and then you grew up knowing that, that could have an effect on you.

So let's say that you had some blocks about money, or some poor mindset choices about money, and someone were to come to you with help for that? What are some of the things that you would tell that person? Or how would you help them get over some of these setbacks around money that they have?

Bob Wheeler
So, one of the first things I do when people tell me they have a block around money, or they have a belief about money. I asked them, "How does it serve you? And what's it costing you?" Because I like, you know, cost benefit analysis. I'm an accountant.

So, what is it costing me to not go out and have pleasure? What is it costing me not to go out and buy the new car? Or do those things that might actually benefit me, if I have a belief that everybody's going to judge me, or rich people are evil, whatever that might be, I really want to explore what's the cost benefit emotionally, to me.

What I start to also ask people, is that true? Or is that a story? So, sometimes, like my story was only rich people travel. And so I couldn't actually see beyond that until somebody looked at me and said, "Bob, that's silly. Everybody travels." And even then I was really scared to get on a plane.

That seems so simple, but I grew up in a small town. And that was just something that I got as a kid. My parents never traveled. And so I want to ask people, what's it costing you? And what's the comfort that you get to stay in this?

Like, I don't have to be big. I don't have to worry about failure and really explore those things and see if do I want to have a different outcome? And if people are comfortable where they are, I'm not here to say you must do it this way. I'm just offering you more potential for more pleasure and more amazing life, if you want to have it. You don't have to. It's an invitation.

Jeremy Deighan
Awesome. Okay, cool. So, do a cost benefit analysis, see if it's hurting you or harming you. Or what would be the benefits of that. I find that we get hung up so much on beliefs around money, and they really can hold us back and get us stuck.

And it's such a fine line, because there's the ability to have fun and spend money, but it can also get you in a pretty bad predicament if you're not careful with your money, which is why I believe the savings and the budgeting helps out because that gives you a little barrier to screw up and still be okay. Right?

Bob Wheeler
Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, I think the reason for me that saving is all that is important is like I knew that I never had a safety net. My parents were not multimillionaires, they weren't gonna leave a lot of money. The positive piece from that is, I've never expected that.

Now I have a lot of friends that don't want to upset their parents or do certain things because they don't want to lose their inheritance. And so money is a great way to manipulate people, right?

If you're nice, I'll prove that I love you by giving you some money. And then so we bring in that whole component where people are devastated when they get disinherited, or mom and dad actually blew through their inheritance, which I hear all the time, "My parents are going through my money!" Wow.

And so saving and being self reliant for me was just a really important part of the puzzle for me.

Jeremy Deighan
Yeah, and it's invigorating. I mean, it makes you feel self accomplishment that you set a goal. Even, like you said, $1,000 in a savings account. Someone who's never had that before in their life, that can be life changing for them to say, "I've been saving $20 for, you know, a year or two years now. And I have $1,000 put away."

And that's can be a really exciting feeling. And then that grows, you know, that builds on more savings, like you said, 1000, 2000, 5000, until you get to a point where you look back and say, you know, "Look how far I come from my beliefs about money and being held back to where I am today."

Bob Wheeler
Absolutely. And I got to tell you, like, and I was in a lot of debt. And I was making a lot of poor choices, even though I was outwardly appearing to be very successful.

It is so much more comforting, and so much less stressful when I go to sleep at night, knowing that I've got extra cash, that I've got investments, and that if something catastrophic happened, I can handle it. And I'm going to bounce back. It's not going to take me out. But several years ago, that was not the case. It is nice to have that peace of mind.

Jeremy Deighan
Right? Definitely. Very cool. Now, I know that we have many listeners from different countries. And so I was wondering if I could ask you some general advice. We can't get too specific, because we're gonna have different countries and different laws and what have you.

But regarding taxes, you know, I know that this is something else that really stumps and really hurts a lot of new entrepreneurs. They don't understand the importance of paying their taxes. And I've talked to some people they can really end up owing a lot.

Is there any kind of general advice you can give around? Just making sure that you have your taxes in check?

Bob Wheeler
Yeah, absolutely. Well, there's a couple things for sure. Whatever your tax rate is, in whatever country you live in, make sure that you are taking a percentage and putting it away.

So I have a lot of clients in the US. And I'll say, take 30% of your gross and put it aside 30%, which is a little high, because by the time you take out expenses and things like that, hopefully you're in a lower bracket, each client is slightly different, but usually I'll start with 30%. Just put away 30%. That's not yours.

But the other place where people get in trouble is with sales tax in the US, you know, if I'm selling a product, and I'm collecting $1.10 and 10 cents is the tax, that's not my money. But I'll see a lot of people you know, they bring it in, and then they spend that sales tax money and then the sales tax bill comes due, and it's already been spent.

So, really learn to separate and put that money in separate accounts because it doesn't really belong to you. That's a really important thing. The other important thing is if you especially if you're starting a business, even if you don't hire somebody full time, you should at least get some professional advice to sit down and talk about should I be a corporation? Should I be a sole proprietor? Should I be taking a salary?

I've had people that were losing money in their business and paying themselves $100,000 in salary. You're paying $15,000 in payroll taxes. What are you doing? "Oh, I thought I had to take a salary." No.

Or other people take a draw, and they think it's a salary because they wrote salary in the memo. I'm like, that's not a salary. Just because you call it a chicken doesn't make it a chicken.

So, really getting a little bit advice before you start out, I work with a lot of people where I just meet with them one time, and I'll say, "Look, when you get going, come back and see me, I'll help you. But, here's what I would do. Because don't spend your money until you're making money. Here's where you can afford to not spend as much money until you get more successful."

But I see so many people not understanding how loss carry forward works, or how capital gains and losses work and things like that. And had they just had a 30 minute conversation or an hour conversation with a professional, they might have been able to strategize and really maximize their their tax savings.

Jeremy Deighan
Okay, very cool. Now, is there any services or software that you recommend for keeping track of this a little better?

Bob Wheeler
So many people use QuickBooks, I hate to endorse them. But that's what a lot of people know. And that's a great program. There's Quicken, there's Mint. There are so many great little programs out there, whether it's an app.

A lot of my clients that are in the entertainment industry, I know they're not going to do that stuff. So I tell them, "Look, get 12, big manila envelopes, write car expense, rent, telephone, and just throw your receipts into each of the categories, we'll deal with it at the end of the year. If you're not sure if it's an expense, that's deductible, put it in anyway. Because all I can do is tell you no. But if you don't put it in there, it's a missed opportunity."

So whatever works for you, I like Excel spreadsheets. And I track and do budgeting through Excel, because I just, I'm an Excel geek, but whatever works for you, but find something so that you can track your money so that when you sit down and do your tax stuff, you're actually not giving the government any more money than they need. Not that they need it. But that's required.

Jeremy Deighan
You don't want to have a savings account with the IRS. So thinking about the audience listening today, so we have people from all walks of life, entrepreneurs, business owners, people who are in little niche industries, making online courses.

What would be your best piece of advice for someone who is maybe starting out on their journey, they're starting to have some income coming in and seeing some money that they haven't had before. What would be something that you could tell those listeners today?

Bob Wheeler
First thing I would say is learn to let the money stay in your bank account for a little bit. I think people have a habit of as soon as we start getting newfound money, we go out and blow it and take it right back to our comfort level. So just let it sit and look at and go, "Hi new money, thank you for coming in."

And then secondly is to make sure you're tracking income and expenses for the business so that we can get the best write off so that we can actually keep most of that money. And I can't stress enough the importance of getting professional advice.

The same person that gives me advice may not be the same person that gives you advice. There's not always a perfect fit for everybody. So find somebody that you trust and resonate with. But getting that advice and creating a plan.

You want to create a plan. And that's what budgeting does. That's what writing down your life goals does. You want to come up with a plan so that as this money comes in, you can put that aside and then actually use it to build your future.

I had a client that was making all this money. He came to me the first year, and we're going through the stuff and I said, "You made an extra half a million dollars." "Oh, yeah, I forgot about that." Like, you forgot about a half a million dollars? He said, "Well, you know, I told myself, this is a one time deal. And I better just put it away and forget about it and just keep living my life as an artist, because that's all going to go away."

So he just lived as if that never came in. He didn't go out and buy a new car. He didn't do any of that stuff. For the next 10 years, he started making a million dollars a year he had worked on this project that paid this amazing royalty. And every year he'd say this will be the last year.

But he always acted as if that money wasn't in his bank account. It wasn't until 10 years in that he said, "Do you think I could buy a car now?" He's got a few million dollars in the bank, I think you can buy a car. But he tricked himself. And he didn't just say, "Oh, now I can live a bigger life." He just said, "I'm just gonna keep living my life because I have a good life."

And he stayed within his means and just let that money accumulate. Now, he doesn't have to work another day in his life, because he saved all that money and lived within his means.

Jeremy Deighan
Yeah, I think that's the most powerful message is keeping the same mentality that you have when you start seeing that success. And knowing that, you know, making sure that you are going to stay within your means and you're going to budget and save.

And as that money comes in, you know, just put it away for a rainy day because lord knows that many things can happen in life and you want to always have a little something to fall back on if you need to.

Bob Wheeler
Absolutely.

Jeremy Deighan
Very cool. Bob, this has been a great conversation today. I think it'll help a lot of listeners out there and I appreciate you coming on the podcast. If people want to find out more about you and your business, where can they do that?

Bob Wheeler
So my website is themoneynerve.com. That's not nerd. I'm a nerd, but it's the money nerve. That's got our online course, Mastering The Emotions of Money. It's got information on my podcast, Money You Should Ask.

And there's also a lot of free resources for people, whether it's money in emotions, whether it's business strategies, all of that's there. People can reach out info@themoneynerve.com, and we love to chat with people and help propel them forward.

Jeremy Deighan
Perfect. Well, thank you. We'll make sure that we link all that up in the show notes for this episode. Thanks for coming on the show today. This has been fantastic. And yeah, just hope for your continued success going into the new year and moving forward.

Bob Wheeler
Jeremy, thank you so much. This has just been a lot of fun, and I hope people took something away, and they go and build a better future.

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